Pinheads Using Meaningless Astrology PAC

I must confess that I aspire to be a rational person, and I enjoy following the Skeptic community (no, not the deniers or cynics, but the skeptics). I’m assuredly not always successful, and I try not to judge others too harshly when they aren’t either, but I’m going to relax that rule a bit and mock some aspiring PUMA astrologers.

For anyone not aware, astrology is 100% bunk. It’s not really a political issue, but I noticed the other day some of the dimmer bulbs over at PUMA PAC were drawing up charts for each other.

I think it’s fair to point out that the credulity and lack of critical thinking that would permit someone to put stock into astrology are precisely the characteristics that serve one well as a PUMA. Furthermore, there is a wealth of easily accessible information from authoritative sources about astrology and its utter failure when tested. It takes a deeply incurious person to rely on astrology without ever seeking out such information. Or alternately, it takes somebody who is capable of dismissing loads of information and cherry picking information from disreputable sources that stroke his/her biases. Sounds like PUMA in a nutshell to me!

So who are our PUMA Astrologers?

And that’s just one thread with a handful of PUMAs.

How much stupid can fit into any one person?

43 Responses

  1. Is Durge oops rge FEC must have forgotten to list my Clinton donation Murphy now no longer bothering to hide her Republican roots. The diatribes against the Stimulus Bill are just hilarious. It may as well read:-

    Dear Democrat Senator, you may remember us as the five racists who would not vote for a black Presidential Candidate. Well if you pass this pinko commie stimulus bill we wont vote for you. We want tax cuts for millionaires. Although the only millionaire we know says she supports us, but her magazine endorsed the black guy

  2. Sorry to jack the thread, but did anyone else I see this by “Cinie” on the front page of the retard-fluence? WARNING this is really gross.

    “You know, I’ve been thinking a lot about how and why Black Obama was shoved down America’s throats and all the attendant events surrounding the Obamenon of the Obamanationization of Omerica. I think of how he came out of nowhere with money grown on trees dripping out of his ass…”

    I’m so happy I skipped breakfast.

  3. It kind of goes hand-in-hand with posters of French clowns and unicorns, which I imagine cover the walls of your average PUMA household.

  4. Sinister Forces – yep, the whole thing was quite a post of hers.

    They love it that she can play into all those racist stereotypes they’d all like to express themselves, and they get to applaud.

  5. The following has just been posted on NoQuarter

    Comment by Will Bower | 2009-02-04 15:23:04

    On July 10, 2008, I received the debt information from two sources, John West (of the “300″ Petition, “ClintonDems”, “Democracy Workshop”, and “I Own My Vote”) and Cynthia Ruccia (of “Women for Fair Politics”).

    Both West and Ruccia later contacted Caren Turner (of “ToGetHer4Us”) to confirm with her that they had indeed been my sources.

    John West later went on to reveal his source as having been Jamie Brazil — a cousin of Hillary Clinton (as he has been described to me) — who (according to West) had received that information in a conference call with Clinton finance-team leader, Jonathan Mantz.

    There were other witnesses who had heard such information being generated by one or more of the sources listed above, namely, individuals within the organization “Real Democrats USA”… although they themselves were not responsible for passing that information on to other sources.

    This is how it came to pass that I shared this information with the media. We now know that this information was faulty. At the time, however, I had believed these sources to be reliable ones.
    Reply to this comment

    Comment by UKforDems | 2009-02-04 15:44:52

    So as well as you the following organisations and people “misspoke”

    John West (of the “300″ Petition, “ClintonDems”, “Democracy Workshop”, and “I Own My Vote”) and Cynthia Ruccia (of “Women for Fair Politics”).

    Caren Turner (of “ToGetHer4Us”)

    “Jamie Brazil” — a cousin of Hillary Clinton (???)

    Clinton finance-team leader, Jonathan Mantz. (A finance Team Leader??) You went on Fox a good site for Clinton fundraising at the time on the say so of a Team Leader?

    Unnamed “namely individuals” within the organization “Real Democrats USA.

    Do you ever take responsibility for what you did? Which was to do more than any other individual to undermine the attempts by Hillary Clinton, the person you supposedly actively supported for President, to clear her debts. You do also know you are 6 months late as you made no attempt to correct it – until now.

  6. Thanks for posting this.

    On Jamie Brazil – everywhere I’ve looked, he’s described as a “long-time family friend” of the Clintons, not a cousin at all.

    Whatever his relationship with them, it didn’t stop him holding a get-together before the DNC with Carly Fiorina, Mr McCain’s senior economic advisor, at his home, along with Hillary’s wayward brother Tony Rodham and family, and later taking a post as Director of Citizens for McCain, tasked with identifying Democrat leaders in key states who might persuade Clinton voters to switch to McCain. So no conflict of interest there, then.

  7. I wonder why he announced his mea culpa (of sorts) today? He helped to undermine the Hillary camp and her attempts at clearing her debt. Is there a real apology? No. He is saying what every true Democratic supporter has said for ages – you can not trust the PUMA movement.

    (I still find it highly amusing that his site is now “sexist” in every way possible)

  8. Sean M: linky for the stinky?

  9. Sean M’s quotes come from this thread, in case anyone’s having trouble finding it:

    http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2008/08/21/a-retraction/

    Bower’s been circling round these “revelations” for a few weeks now (about a week ago, he popped up on PUMA PAC and posted something similar to this earlier NQ comment of his):

    Comment by Will Bower | 2008-12-04 12:14:54

    Indeed, it appears as if we were given faulty information about Hillary’s debt back in June.

    Our sources included a relative of Hillary and a high ranking member of her finance team. We felt it was safe to trust the information we were given.

    It’s still not clear to us as to what the shell game was regarding those numbers.

    http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2008/12/03/late-nite-open-thread-hillarys-debt/

    Maybe he’s looking to rehabilitate himself now that he’s gone “full-time” and given up ratfucking (yeah, right)?

    If so, posting his “explanation” on a thread at (the now relatively deserted) No Quarter whose last comment was on August 24 seems a funny way to go about it, unless it’s a dress rehearsal … or maybe a guilty conscience.

  10. Will Bower is an Asshole.

  11. linky for the stinky?

    I’ve got a post in moderation again (two links, DUH!), but here it is, split into two:

    Sean M’s quotes come from this thread, in case anyone’s having trouble finding it:

    http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2008/08/21/a-retraction/

  12. Bower’s been circling round these “revelations” for a few weeks now (about a week ago, he popped up on PUMA PAC and posted something similar to this earlier NQ comment of his):

    Comment by Will Bower | 2008-12-04 12:14:54

    Indeed, it appears as if we were given faulty information about Hillary’s debt back in June.

    Our sources included a relative of Hillary and a high ranking member of her finance team. We felt it was safe to trust the information we were given.

    It’s still not clear to us as to what the shell game was regarding those numbers.

    http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2008/12/03/late-nite-open-thread-hillarys-debt/

    Maybe he’s looking to rehabilitate himself now that he’s gone “full-time” and given up ratfucking (yeah, right)?

    If so, posting his “explanation” on a thread at (the now relatively deserted) No Quarter whose last comment was on August 24 seems a funny way to go about it, unless it’s a dress rehearsal … or maybe a guilty conscience.

  13. From looking at the Justsaynodeal site, it is now clear why he wanted to hang round with the PUMAs. He wanted a cougar. His website now smacks of all of the sexist attitudes he was calling Democratic supporters out for.

  14. OK, now I’m just even more confused than usual.

    What does “bare the truth out of the tank & ‘in-thync'” and “get your daily dos” mean? And is it unpatriotic to use the stars & stripes as a bath sheet?

  15. I had a huge debate with him in the live chat during the blog talk radio show Unusable Signal on Saturday. I called him out on a whole bunch of isht for about an hour. The guy is a true idiot and I proved it in front of Puma’s and others. He is in constant denial about everything, what a tool!

  16. (Apols for hijacking the thread btw)

  17. “I had a huge debate with him …”

    I guess, being livechat, there was no way to save it?

  18. Thanks, Sean and YAFB. JohnD, wish I could’ve seen you school that freaking fraud. I don’t know why the PUMAs don’t “man-lynch” the asshole for flushing away any shred of credibility they ever had and sinking HRC’s debt reduction efforts.* Oh yeah, because they’re a bunch of gullible jackasses, that’s why.

    *Not that those idiots were about to rake in millions of dollars anyway. But still.

  19. They would not have had, but a good chunk of the Hillary supporters she was targeting in those final days watch fox. How many of those did he affect?

  20. Something’s obviously smelly about the timeline Bower’s talking about up there.

    Without doing a complete dissection of the state of Hillary’s fundraising, here’s what Jonathan Mantz said to Heidi Li on that very same day that Bower claims to have received the information:

    Breaking news straight from Senator Clinton’s director of finance regarding retiring the debt

    To clarify where the Clinton campaign stands on the issue of “deadlines” and retiring Senator Clinton’s debt, I emailed Jonathan Mantz, Senator Clinton’s incredibly hardworking and successful director of finance (head of fundraising) first thing this morning. See the exchange below. There is no more reliable source of information.

    HL Feldman Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 7:54 AM
    To: jmantz.com,
    I have been working extremely hard in response to [your] last communication to “top” fundraisers, in which [you] said the campaign is making a big push for donations to retire debt, and that this push was to run through the 15th.

    Has the closing date for this “push” changed? I could really use an answer.

    Jonathan Mantz Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 9:12 AM
    To: heidi

    No real closing date, we are trying to put a dent into this as quickly as possible. Although the response has been good so far, we have ways to go

    Pls keep up all you are doing

    http://heidilipotpourri.blogspot.com/2008/07/breaking-news-straight-from-senator.html

  21. Damn yafb, I should have taken some screen shots, I couldn’t believe the actual WB was there but after chatting for a few minutes it was apparent it was really his dumb ass. He was spouting off so much BS about how it wasn’t his fault but some sort of misinformation from his sources. F’him.

  22. Never mind, John. It was just a thought. It might have been fun to watch him squirm, but it looks like there’ll be plenty more BS from him soon enough! (On this blog, even? Here, Will, here, Will …)

    Rooting around a little in what going on with PUMA/JSND etc. during that period (in a nutshell, it looks like nobody had much of a clue, and that may extend into Hillary’s campaign staff), I get the feeling he thought he’d give he PUMAs a morale boost that was much needed at the time.

    They were demoralized enough that Hillary’d lost the nomination, let alone being asked to put their hands in their pockets yet again just to pay off her debt, the only carrot being that it might help have her delegates roll-called at the Convention. Fools and their money and all that, but if the blog commenters are to be believed, a lot of people did without to keep financing her.

    I guess it’s all down to foolish propagandists who believed their own propaganda.

    If I was Hillary, though, WB would be toast. The Clintons never forget, so they say …

  23. Gee, Will Bower is a passive-aggressive do-nothing who has no apparent agency or responsibility for what he does and says, and is constantly being victimized by others!

    Color me shocked, SHOCKED that he should be a PUMA!

  24. Heh. WB just repeated his NQ comment on an old, old post over at Yes To Democracy:

    http://www.yestodemocracy.com/yes_to_democracy_no_to_pu/2008/07/uh-oh-pumas-got/comments/page/2/#comments

    It looks to me like he’s trying to safeguard his place in history!

  25. Its so that people will stop asking whether he lied about or whether he stole it. It wasn’t him that lied, obviously, it was all those PUMA people.

    If there is a prize for the most stupid PUMA – he has to be on the short-list.

  26. Any bets as to whether Bower tries (or tried) to post that crap at Effluence or PUMA Central? I can’t imagine there’s a whole lot of love for him from Darragh or Chucky.

  27. Tom65, I think I read somewhere that he did show up on PUMAPAC with the same lame-ass justification. Maybe one of our resident PUMAlogists can shed some light…

  28. Here you go:

    Will Bower 01.24.09 at 11:00 pm

    Thank you all for the warm welcome! I’ll be emailing actioncenter@pumapac.org a.s.a.p.!

    And, Trish…

    If you’d like to know more about how we received the debt information we did, I’d be happy to give you some of the history. I don’t I think I should post it *too* openly (for the time being), but I’ll be glad to answer what questions I can about it.

    We have since learned that the original source may have had a lack of concern about passing on reliable information. I had little reason to mistrust my direct sources, but it seems as if *they* may have had reasons to mistrust *theirs*.

    Have no doubt — if I could change one thing about the last 6 months — it would be to not have passed on unreliable information. I was very new to the “Source” game and learned the hard way.

    http://pumapac.org/2009/01/24/another-edition-of-5/#comment-281109

  29. And now, a version that will post without waiting for moderation:

    Will Bower 01.24.09 at 11:00 pm

    And, Trish…

    If you’d like to know more about how we received the debt information we did, I’d be happy to give you some of the history. I don’t I think I should post it *too* openly (for the time being), but I’ll be glad to answer what questions I can about it.

    We have since learned that the original source may have had a lack of concern about passing on reliable information. I had little reason to mistrust my direct sources, but it seems as if *they* may have had reasons to mistrust *theirs*.

    Have no doubt — if I could change one thing about the last 6 months — it would be to not have passed on unreliable information. I was very new to the “Source” game and learned the hard way.

    http://pumapac.org/2009/01/24/another-edition-of-5/#comment-281109

  30. The PUMA lot realy are stupid bitter bigots. He tells NoQuarter it was all the fault of the evil PUMAs and Hillary herself. He did not lie. HE says to PUMAPAC, I can not tell you openly, but it was “dark forces” and they but it quicker than they do sheets at a linen sale.

    They even say “I love you”.

    Did you see Darrag h No Clinton Donation Yet Murphy is still collecting money from these bigots? She wants $50k. Cult??

  31. I’m continuing to track Bower’s spamming of his “explanation” far and wide.

    Latest reported hit is on this Rumproast thread from last August (h/t Kevin K):

    http://www.rumproast.com/index.php/site/comments/paging_puma_head_will_bower_will_bower_please_report_to_the_white_courtesy/

  32. I wonder if it will remain too afraid to blame PUMA on the PUMA sites?

  33. Here’s the only Google hit you’ll get for Bower’s screed at the moment (who’s the tame journo?).

    http://www.worldnewstrust.com/wnt-reports/commentary/hillary-s-campaign-debt-congrats-hillary-supporters-re-payment.html

  34. Here’s a new one from Democratic Underground (not Bower posting directly, but the comments look a little, erm, lively so far!):

    http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=334×12528

  35. Ah, and here’s another one (Google’s being a bit temperamental at the moment, basically a clone of the World News Trust article):

    http://texashillblog.blogspot.com/2009/02/hillarys-campaign-debt-congrats-pumas.html

  36. *Ouch* And a cross-link to this site from TheBigotBasher, so I see! (Anyone we know?)

    Meanwhile, over in the wintry, loveless desert that is The Effluence, out of nowhere, something unspeakable stirs:

    myiq2xu, on February 9th, 2009 at 7:28 am Said:

    Google “Michelle Obama Klingon” and you’ll get 11, 200 results.

    http://riverdaughter.wordpress.com/2009/02/09/harshmellow/#comment-296469

    Style: 0.5 (total non-sequitur)
    Execution: 0.9 (no spelling errors)
    Difficulty: 0

    1.4 points deducted for trying too hard to bait me.

    Total score: FAIL

  37. I am absolutely crushed to find out I was left off of your list of Puma astrology bloggers. Let me point out my recent post on the topic.

    http://camelsnose.wordpress.com/2009/01/26/whats-your-sign/

    I notice I’m not on your blogroll either.

  38. Lol, Thank’s Nikma. I hadn’t noticed you were dabbling in the retarded arts.

    There’s a pretty strong correlation between lack of critical thinking and PUMAism, eh?

  39. Don’t knock it if you haven’t tried it. Did you read it yet?

  40. What to do mean try it? Astrology is without uses.

  41. Go ahead, click on it. You know you want to.

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